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Thursday, 26th November 2009

Scots finds home on gey muckle website

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Published Date:
24 February 2008
AN ENCYCLOPAEDIA in the language of Rabbie Burns is now available at the click o' a moose.
A Scots-language version of Wikipedia has already attracted more than 2,200 entries on subjects as diverse as "airchaeology" and "sodgerin".

The English-language edition of the free online encyclopaedia has become one of the great success stories
of the internet age with more than two million contributions.

Scots enthusiasts, already buoyed by the SNP's decision to add the "mither tongue" to the school curriculum, have hailed the site as another shot in the arm for the long-neglected language.

But the Scots Wikipedia has also been ridiculed as an embarrassing parody of the language used by Sir Walter Scott and Hugh MacDiarmid.

The site – which claims to be the first encyclopaedia in the Scots leid, or language – has already attracted more articles than longer-established sites in the Maori and Kashmiri languages.

But the site's "leet o' weel kent Scots fowk" features just 13 individuals and there is no room yet for icons such as Robert the Bruce, John Logie Baird, Alexander Graham Bell, Alexander Fleming, Robert Louis Stevenson, David Hume and Adam Smith. Modern-day names such as Sir Sean Connery, Alex Salmond, Gordon Brown and Ewan McGregor are also absent.

Instead, alongside Burns and William Wallace, there are entries for GMTV presenter Jenni Falconer: "She haes forbye presentit the ITV traivel shaw How to Holiday"; Gail Porter, who shot to fame because of a "gey muckle FHM photie on the Hooses o Pairlament wi aa her claes aff"; and Oor Wullie, "a loun that sits on a bucket wi a moose cried Jeemy".

One of biggest entries is for Glasgow Airport attack hero John Smeaton who gets more than 200 words compared with just 70 for Wallace. Smeaton's entry states: "He became inrowed in coonterin a failt terrorist bellum on the airport."

Other subjects covered in the Scots Wikipedia include "airchitectur". "the airts", "eddication", "releegion", "ingineerin" and "pheesics".

Dr Chris Robinson, director of the Dictionary of the Scots Language, was delighted by the increasing numbers of people visiting the site. "What is particularly encouraging is that it gets people accustomed to reading a huge range of different things in Scots and not just literature," she said.

"The fact it is doing well gives a lie to all those people who decry Scots and try to do it down."

But Robinson conceded that attempting to create universal spellings for Scots words could be a "minefield". "It is a very difficult job to come up with one spelling that doesn't alienate half of the country," she said.

Stuart Kelly, Scotland on Sunday's literary editor, felt the site failed to do justice to the rich heritage of Scots.

He said: "I don't think anyone nowadays considers Scots as slang or 'incorrect English'. However, this seems convoluted at best, and an absolute parody at worst.

"The great tradition of Douglas, Burns, Scott and MacDiarmid means more than just altering the vowels and dropping the g from present participles."

Ted Brocklebank, culture spokesman for the Scottish Tories, felt attempts to create a universal Scots language were contrived and doomed to failure.

He said: "There are a number of rich variations of the English language spoken in Scotland, from Doric in the north-east, to Lallans in the Borders and the Nordic Scots of Orkney and Shetland. But none of them qualify as languages in their own right.

"This website appears to be a cheap attempt at creating a language. Simply taking an English word and giving it a Scots phonetic does not make it into a Scots word."

Language or dialect?

The use and status of Scots has caused numerous stooshies – or rows – over the centuries.

Originating in Denmark, Scots is related to the language of the Angles who invaded the north of England in the fifth century and used words like hoose, coo and stane.

Scots is also influenced by the culture of the Vikings, whose language, Norse, contained words like greet, muckle and midden.

Scots was brought to Scotland in the 12th century by the English servants of Norman lords. In 1603, the accession of James VI of Scotland to the throne of England signalled the end of Scots' official status in favour of its southern sister language, English.

Critics have long argued that Scots is at best a dialect and at worst a poor version of English.

Ted Brocklebank, of the Scottish Conservatives, said: "We have dialects of English such as Doric and Lallans, which are very rich, but they are not separate languages."

But Rob Gibson, an SNP MSP, disagreed, saying: "It produces internationally recognised literature and inspires our understanding of past literature."



Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 23 February 2008 7:16 PM
  • Source: Scotland On Sunday
  • Location: Scotland
  • Related Topics: Scots language
 
1

Conan the Librarian™,

24/02/2008 00:34:37
"Scots was brought to Scotland in the 12th century by the English servants of Norman lords."

WTF?

Marc.
Do some research eh?

Scots is descended from "Middle English" via some Norse, and there were people speaking it in Scotland far before the 12th century.
2

Fifi la Bonbon,

24/02/2008 00:35:27
Hoots, mon. And Och Aye the noo.
3

Conan the Librarian™,

24/02/2008 00:44:41
3
Awright me old china?Lordluvaduck them sweaties are avin a laff, eh?
4

Rankbadyin,

Palmerston North 24/02/2008 06:51:23
It is ironic that a Scot in New Zealand should have to point out how lacking this story is in substance (since there are numerous, serious Scots who have reached a different conclusion when working to establish our toungue's history and credibility)- and how assinine these early responses have been. Anyone wishing to to obtain sensible and credible information is encouraged to visit www.scotslanguage.com or uk.geocities.com/rfairnie@btinternet.com.
5

Selgovae,

Scottish Borders 24/02/2008 08:55:06
As someone once said, a language is a dialect with an army.

"gives a lie to all those people who decry Scots and try to do it down"

What is he talking about? Does "doing it down" mean not wanting a Scots dictionary on my bookshelf? It's the way we speak, but nothing more. Why the need to turn it into some kind of holy grail.
6

Pilrig.,

Livingston 24/02/2008 09:44:23
5 & 6 - This is Scotland, most of the inhabitants speak Scots, despite the best efforts of the Educational Establishment to eradicate our LANGUAGE.
The latter are in a fankle about the teaching of Scottish history too, cos they did their damned best to downgrade to to an irrelevance.
7

Boy Wonder,

24/02/2008 10:21:40
Scots was brought to Scotland in the 12th century by the English servants of Norman lords.

??????

Marc Horne ... Yer a eejit!!!

Scots hus bin spoke here as a developin language since the meltin poat o the 6th n 7th century ... at least half a thoosan years afore Wullie the Conkerer's Norman mates goat a lift up tae the borders, wi the likes o Malcolm III's weans, an plantit their buskins here!
8

Boy Wonder,

24/02/2008 10:22:45
I repeat ... Marc Horne ... yer a eejit!!!
9

Mcsnagpile,

24/02/2008 10:27:44
yer ideas ur mockit.
jis shut yer geggie
10

Kenny A,

24/02/2008 10:50:18
6~ Fraid I dont talk any form of Welch. Gaelic when at home I do. Saying that both languages share a very distant root.

Also of the opinion that Scots is a dialect. When talking to East Coasters or Orkadians very difficult to understand, but they are speaking English. I know that because a few times I have had to ask.

I do not mean this in any form of negative way but they cannot be said to be just useing an accent as the words used are not common, a dailect fair enough.

Now't wrong with a bit of diversity I think.
11

HIBERNIAN5,

24/02/2008 11:22:30
mr muklebank isnay chuffed nay matter how much hees puffed weil no hud it at all agin him jest next time we vote itll no ging bye him aye gies our mother tongue wi glee thanks to all inclooding my mp
12

Gothic Rose,

24/02/2008 12:12:52
Roy Gibson and Ted Brocklebank are both correct.So whats the problem.?
13

bus user,

edinburgh 24/02/2008 12:26:23
Irrespective of different dialect words throughout Scotland, which is problem enough in itself, there is no universal orthography for Scots. English orthography took centuries to evolve and partly stabilise, yet it has now dropped the double consonant in words like labelled [labeled] as British English follows US English orthography. The idea of Scots resurgam is fine, with its different grammar and syntax, as long as no-one expects it to actually happen.
Christopher Grieve used an artificial Scots for his work, using dialect words from here and there, and the Norwegians invented Nynorsk by grafting the most different dialect words from Standard Swedish they could find, onto that same Swedish syntax. It's interesting to speculate what the government of an independent Scotland would do with language to reinforce the difference from England, so perhaps the Nynorsk/Grieve model is not so far-fetched.
14

Gothic Rose,

24/02/2008 12:32:59
Do the primary schools, still have the "Robert Burns poetry award" for recitation?
15

Gothic Rose,

24/02/2008 14:24:35
Well do they?
16

Gothic Rose,

24/02/2008 14:27:24
It was a certificate.will look back later for the answer.
17

Mìcheal a Eilean Rùim,

Richmond 24/02/2008 15:18:38
"Scots finds home on gey muckle website."

HOME? Has the word "Hame" now been abandoned. Home looks really weird in the middle of a Scots sentence.

Is "The Anglo-Scotsman on Sunday" about to be launched?
18

Gothic Rose,

24/02/2008 16:02:13
Scots "FINDS"!!!!!What a joke.And I`m an eleven plus failure.
19

Hamish Scott,

24/02/2008 16:07:59
Ted Brocklebank is the Tories culture spokesman??!! Shouldn't a culture spokesman know about the indigenous culture of the country he's in?
20

Selgovae,

24/02/2008 18:46:25
#16

Some do. My kid has a certificate from a few years back, but that was for singing Burns, not reciting. It was singing when I was at school too.

I take it the Burns poems still have the glossary at the side.
21

ThePeter,

24/02/2008 21:43:37
Oh come on
Scots is just a variation of English
Like geordie is
Like brummie is
Like cockney is

People who pretend otherwise are gae muckle pillocks
22

The Pict.,

Canada 25/02/2008 01:14:40
Both SCOTS and ENGLISH have a common root: 'LOW GERMAN' That is why several words are the SAME.e.g. THE, A, YES. The word CAT is neither. It came from Gaelic.
For TED: Why can't the English say loCH or ach etc etc etc.
So actually its the English who speak SCOTS with an accent.

There is no such thing as OLD English as it is 'OLD' LOW GERMAN.
Slainte'.
23

d.j.,

25/02/2008 14:35:49
Can someone please explain why there are so many words written in Scots and Doric which only has one or at most two letters that are different from English?
24

d.j.,

25/02/2008 15:56:06
I hope things go really well for you all; at least it is essentially Scottish. It came to me very forcefully in company last night that the English and French would never ever on any occassion put down their own language or any part of their history or culture for anyone and why should they.

Yet Scots of all varieties do so all the time. Why?
25

Over the Top,

25/02/2008 16:53:55
What a pleasure to see that things are going well. Keep up the good work.
26

The Hiker,

Fife. 07/12/2008 13:35:28
15 and 16 Gothic Rose.

Yes, both my boys aged 15 and 22, have a certificate for reciting Robert Burns.
School in East Fife.

 

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