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Saturday, 21st November 2009

'Celtic Lion will roar', Salmond promises US

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Published Date: 01 April 2008
ALEX Salmond claimed yesterday that he would be judged on his success in growing Scotland's economy, describing it as the "defining mission" of his government.
The First Minister told a business audience in the United States that he would create a "Celtic Lion" economy in Scotland and that this was "within our grasp".

Speaking at the start of Scotland Week – a series of events to promote Scotland in th
e United States – the First Minister championed the cut in business rates which comes into force today.

Addressing a joint gathering of Harvard's Center for European Studies and the Business Schools, Mr Salmond said: "I want to speak with you about the growing ambition in my country, our belief and our aspiration in building a Celtic Lion, a new economic powerhouse that will be one of the great success stories of the global economy.

He said this is "the defining mission of my government".

"It is the purpose that lies at the heart of the decisions we have already made, and those which are to come," he added.

"It is an aspiration that is within our grasp. And, on the eve of a major tax cut for Scottish business, it is an ambition we are daily bringing to reality.

"Scotland will become a Celtic Lion. We will build an economy that is the envy of Europe. That is my aim. That is my ambition."

The First Minister has already pledged to increase Scotland's growth rate to the UK average by 2011 and to match the growth rates of small independent countries like Ireland and Iceland by 2017.

He believes that, if he can achieve that, he will have created a Celtic Lion economy.

Mr Salmond also urged American entrepreneurs last night to "go east" and invest in Scotland.

"The legendary Horace Greeley urged a generation of Americans to 'Go west, young man'. Nearly 200 years later, the time is right for American business to focus their investment in a different direction.

"My message now is 'Go east, young industry'. East to Scotland. Invest in the economies of the future, where the prospects are brightest. And make that investment in Scotland, which I believe has one of the brightest prospects across all Europe."

Last night's address at Harvard was the first of three speeches Mr Salmond will give this week.

The second is on democracy at the University of Virginia and the last on energy at the National Geographic Society in Washington.

Mr Salmond said that the week will showcase Scotland's academic reputation, business expertise and cultural success.

Also in America this week is Jim Mather, the enterprise minister, who was in Seattle yesterday to host a breakfast for Globalscot members – business people with Scottish connections – and a Scottish Development International reception.

Mr Mather will meet Microsoft managers in California today, before travelling on to Texas where he will visit Houston and Austin.

Linda Fabiani, the external affairs minister, is also in the United States, attending cultural events in New York and Washington this week.

New name and a new tone as week gets serious

THIS week's programme of events in the United States has been renamed Scotland Week from the previous Tartan Week to make it clearer to Americans what it is all about.

But, as well as the change in name, there has been a change in tone.

Instead of the high-profile Scottish Village in Grand Central Station and the glamorous Dressed to Kilt fashion evening of previous years, there are more serious speeches by the First Minister and smaller events, with invited guests.

There has been some concern from those involved in previous Tartan Week programmes that this year's events will be too low-key.

It has also been suggested Alex Salmond will merely to talking to those who already know about Scotland, rather than spreading the message to a new audience.

Many of the people who will attend the events are either from the Globalscot business network or are so-called "affinity Scots" – people who already have some knowledge of Scotland.

However, a spokesman for the First Minister insisted that the scope of this year's events was much wider than in previous years, taking in Texas and California, as well as Washington and New York.

He also said that Mr Salmond's speeches would reach a wide audience, and would not just be aimed at affinity Scots.





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  • Last Updated: 01 April 2008 9:14 AM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Tartan Week
 
1

Angus Ogg,

31/03/2008 22:35:12
Well this makes a change.

As president Bill Clinton's famous election party HQ Banner said: its "The Economy Stupid".

So Jack McConnell's leather kilt has been ditched, and the new Scottish politicians are pressing for Scottish jobs and the Scottish economy.

That'll do.
2

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01/04/2008 00:21:12
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01/04/2008 00:35:15
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4

Paul in Oz,

Helensburgh 01/04/2008 00:40:08
AM2 keep going! Love the see all of the SNP activists on these boards get a shoeing once in a while!
5

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01/04/2008 00:48:36
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6

The Daleks,

Longmen 01/04/2008 00:56:30
#8 AM2

"Easy Pickings"

In your own mind. Maybe you think you're scoring points, but nobody else does apart from a few deluded Unionistas.

The Union is over bar the shouting. Fold your tent and go back to wherever it was you came from.
7

Hen Mc Stoorie,

Port William 01/04/2008 01:02:16
AM2...Ar*e Meister the second.
8

Gregor Addison,

Glasgow 01/04/2008 01:05:03
AM2,

glad to see your constitutional chums embracing socialism?
9

democrate,

central Scotland 01/04/2008 01:07:07
#10 AM2

I always make a point of reading your posts as they are normally very entertaining and, occasionally, enlightening. This particular one is a real beauty though as it satisfies on both counts. I thank you for your honesty.

10

Peeablo,

Union of Socialist Scotland - If you believe Right 01/04/2008 01:07:30
AM2

The only 'easy pickings' acquired come from your nose, which couldn't smell a good idea directly under it.

Have a nice day :-)
11

Gregor Addison,

Glasgow 01/04/2008 01:09:16
Gosh, confounded by a meaningless post? You're slipping.
12

Peeablo,

Red LayBore Scotland 01/04/2008 01:11:07
AM2

Why don't you get the fact that the people of Scotland want a referendum? Why not let the people decide? Are you for a referendum YES/NO?

13

democrate,

central Scotland 01/04/2008 01:12:45
The new mantra for New Socialism in Scotland (not yet available elsewhere in the UK, but could be coming to a booth near you soon) brought to you first by our own homegrown AM2 "London Labour starve us of WMD's so that we can pay for our kids."
14

Senga Jean,

Scotland 01/04/2008 01:20:19
John Q is AN2's ventriloquist's dummy. Good going AM2 but I did notice the date. What is your mission called "Demonise the SNP " ? OR perhaps " The Jocks are a Joke. Tee Hee"
15

Paul in Oz,

Helensburgh 01/04/2008 01:27:25
It's just astonding how much political harrying goes on on these boards it is a shame as I am pretty sure the people of scotland would love to haqve their say without all of these activitsts on these boards EVERY day, such a shame
16

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01/04/2008 01:27:51
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01/04/2008 01:33:09
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fifeis great,

Kirkcaldy 01/04/2008 01:38:08
Only one way i would like to vote on subjects like this, is in an election, not a referendum. Come on salmon put it to all the voters, put your money where your mouth is, then there would be no doubts, would this option not be better than trying to find questionsfor a referendum.
19

fifeis great,

Kirkcaldy 01/04/2008 01:38:36
Only one way i would like to vote on subjects like this, is in an election, not a referendum. Come on salmon put it to all the voters, put your money where your mouth is, then there would be no doubts, would this option not be better than trying to find questions for a referendum.
20

fifeis great,

Kirkcaldy 01/04/2008 01:39:18
so good i said it twice (sorry)
21

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01/04/2008 01:40:13
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Senga Jean,

01/04/2008 01:55:40
John Q I looked up scrotum bottom on Wikipaedia and you'r right you are just that. You of course are an enemy of Scotland and the SNP....TROLL
23

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01/04/2008 02:03:58
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01/04/2008 02:09:40
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subrosa,

01/04/2008 02:16:38
# 13 Over bar the shouting, eh? But only 23% of people in Scotland and 19% of people in England want separation.

Can't you change the record just for a day? You don't know the latest figures - nobody does. Polls are a sample. If people in my region were asked it would be far far higher than your quoted 23%.

Alex Salmond is doing a far far better job for Scotland than we've had in 50 years. Now, off you go and look in your files to find something that will counteract that fact.
26

Dekester,

Canada's westcoast 01/04/2008 02:17:32
I enjoy visiting these posts once in a while.

This AM2 guy is amazing. I have never been on when he has not been a poster. 8 times today in 32 posts.

Wow!

My opinion is that you are a political plant. Good on you for spouting your beliefs
You had better hope that ex-pats never get to vote on independence though. As Scotland would be free in a heartbeat, and you my friend would be in a very small minority.

One really has to have travelled to see the yoke that is around Scotlands neck.

All the best.
27

subrosa,

01/04/2008 02:21:01
# 27 & 28

This thread is about our First Minister promoting Scotland in the US. Why does your point about a referendum come into it? I certainly don't think we need a referendum to give Alex Salmond permission to talk about Scotland in the US.
28

Edward,

01/04/2008 02:24:15
How refreshing, a Scottish Administration thats actually doing possitive work to attract inward investment into Scotland
Makes a change from the bunch of free loaders of the previous administration that ran the country down for th last eight to ten years
Alex Salmond is right, Scotland could go a lot stronger without being in the confines of the Union with England, in fact both countries would do well
29

democrate,

central Scotland 01/04/2008 02:39:01
How very uncharacteristic - a Scottish FM saying positive things about Scotland coherently to an international audience, without asking permission from Westminster, and without the ubiquitous chip and shortbread tin. The natives must be what??? Time for the pith hat again GB? Or a series of expeditions to the lumpen masses of the North by Her Majesty's Ministers. Be quelled, damn you!!
30

Neil Waugh,

Old Strathcona 01/04/2008 03:00:07
Alex, come to Alberta and see how an oil economy is really supposed to work. Fort McMurray awaits. We've got lions and tigers and cougars too.
OK, maybe not the cougars.
31

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01/04/2008 03:20:29
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Dekester,

Canada's westcoast 01/04/2008 03:47:51
#39 is right on.

Google it folks. Look at Alberta. Our Scotland would be even more prosperous.

Also look at what the National energy programme did to Alberta in the early eighties.

This is significant because Canada's national liberal party seized control of the the provinces resources,because of jealousy and in so doing crippled the province for years. The word liberal today is still viewed by the vast majority of Albertans as vile as any word can get.

Familiar??

All the best.

33

Dekester,

Canada's westcoast 01/04/2008 03:48:06
#39 is right on.

Google it folks. Look at Alberta. Our Scotland would be even more prosperous.

Also look at what the National energy programme did to Alberta in the early eighties.

This is significant because Canada's national liberal party seized control of the the provinces resources,because of jealousy and in so doing crippled the province for years. The word liberal today is still viewed by the vast majority of Albertans as vile as any word can get.

Familiar??

All the best.

34

Neil Waugh,

Old Strathcona 01/04/2008 04:08:04
#41 Dekester is a Scot of great vision and clarity.
It should also be pointed out that Alberta's two founding races were Scots and Crees.
If Alex ever showed up in Calary I'm sure Mayor Bronco would award him one of Cowtown's coveted white hats.
Does it get any better than that?
35

Neil Waugh,

Old Strathcona 01/04/2008 04:08:14
#41 Dekester is a Scot of great vision and clarity.
It should also be pointed out that Alberta's two founding races were Scots and Crees.
If Alex ever showed up in Calary I'm sure Mayor Bronco would award him one of Cowtown's coveted white hats.
Does it get any better than that?
36

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01/04/2008 04:09:09
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01/04/2008 04:10:29
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01/04/2008 04:10:42
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01/04/2008 04:16:30
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W Smith,

Middle East 01/04/2008 04:59:58
Maybe Mr Mather can ask Microsoft why they would rather set up an operation in Dubai (0% corporation tax) instead of Scotland (28% corporation tax).

DUH!
41

Dougie Douglas,

Brisbane 01/04/2008 05:10:53
W Smith

Dubai makes fantsatic location for a European operation dosen't it?

Double Duh!

You really do loathe anything positive our Governement does don't you?

42

Jimmy the Pie,

01/04/2008 05:22:49
W Smith

When we get our independence we'll decide our own corporation tax.
Any other idiotic questions you want answering?
43

Beth Boyle,

NY 01/04/2008 05:29:06
A big Yawn for the grandstander Salmond. Such big talk and such small actions.
44

Beth Boyle,

NY 01/04/2008 05:29:21
A big Yawn for the grandstander Salmond. Such big talk and such small actions.
45

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01/04/2008 05:30:08
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Jimmy the Pie,

01/04/2008 05:30:48
Beth Boyle,
Don't let us keep you. Feel free to bug6er off
47

Dekester,

Canada's westcoast 01/04/2008 05:34:51
Good stuff this.

We are a strange nation though.

We as a people have had a dramatic influence in much of the world. As Scots. Not as British.

Yet we have this self doubt that is at our very core.

Interesting that # 46 Neil mentioned the Cree along with the Scots of Alberta. It was much the same out here in BC. In both provinces the Scots and the Natives by and large got on well, and often married. Many natives out here have Scots surnames

Interesting too that both races are subservient to colonial masters. The natives are now becoming empowered, and good luck to them ( we do business with many.)

We Scots though appear to like being babied.

Interesting too that alcoholism,suicide, domestic and other violence are more prevalent in both races than in most other developed societies. Low self esteem ??

Sorry for going on..and I am way off topic. It is getting late out here.

All the best, and Scotland forever.

Believe it. The English would be terrified of a united and independent Scotland. Tens of thousands of ex-pats would be re-unified. What would become of jolly old England?

Ignore the AM2's of the world. The live in another time.



48

Beth Boyle,

NY 01/04/2008 05:52:36
Salmond is a good cheerleader but he no more than a cheap mouth piece. A commitment to education and hard work is what raises a nation in the world. Both America and and the whole of the UK are slipping because our youth are only commited to an easy life. The Eastern Nations are hungry for what we have and they will take it because we are asleep at the switch.
49

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 01/04/2008 06:05:41
AM2 in your early posts you trivialized the 1.2% quarterly GDP growth Ireland was able achieve in Q4 2007. Now if a country was able to do that over 4 quarters that would be 4.8% economic growth. Scotland on the other hand has had average GDP growth of 1.8 per annum. So the Irish achieve more than 2.5 times the growth that Scotland does because the are independant and can set their own fiscal policy. You on the other hand would like Scotland to subsume its own self interest for the benefit of south east England.
50

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01/04/2008 06:08:02
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51

Beth Boyle,

NY 01/04/2008 06:17:23
The Irish have had a long time to think about how to get a grip on their economy, they suffered long and hard after independence. They fell down so hard she was the poorest of the educated countries. They also had all their youth and talent leave for so long they were hungry for change is Scotland so hungry? Hard Questions have to be asked. It's not a matter of pride or a rich history its a commitment to a skilled labor force and a unified will for change. Scotland's great achievements in the industrial age may be a good foundation but its been a long while since any product of Scotland has been sought after with any energy except her crude oil. My concerns are for all of the west. We are all in this together. Now the Indians are buying Landrover. It just goes on and on. The bleeding has to be stopped. Lots of giddy talk of Celtic Lions is premature. Right now all western countries are more like sick kittens. If Scotland becomes independent during hard times such as these she needs to have the strength to handle almost certain economic pain that will come with it. Are Scotlands young up to the task I ask you for it will be on their shoulders?
52

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01/04/2008 07:07:29
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53

Nell,

The Preservation Hall 01/04/2008 07:44:01
You can please some of the people some of the time, but you cant please all the people all of the time.
And in Scotland:- You can't please many of the people any of the time.
54

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 07:49:59
#63

Thank you for all of your insightful contributions on the subject of Scotland’s political and economic future.

You obviously have studied this subject at great length, and in some depth.
This can be discerned by application of original thought necessary to come up with such phrases as, “Salmond is a good cheerleader, but a cheap mouthpiece”, and “a big yawn for Salmond the grandstander”.

Both phrases straight out of the Nu Liebor lexicon of personal insults aimed at the First Minister.

I suggest that you review your contributions on this thread and ask yourself two questions, viz;
(a) Why have I made this contribution?
(b) Has this contribution improved the general understanding of the issues surrounding this debate?

In addition, perhaps you should also consider turning your attention to the economic future of Latvia outwith the Soviet Union?

You probably know as much about that subject as you appear to know about Scotland.
55

John S,

01/04/2008 07:56:46
Why is the UK Parliament (English) desperate to keep Scotland in the UK ?
Why if we have been such a drain on English resources for so long, why didn't they kick us out years ago ?
Why are the English not asking for their own independence ?
56

Rob7,

England 01/04/2008 08:11:59
#67 Totally agree. I pray that England will be free soon.

Going back to the main subject - I thought the Lion was from Africa - is he planning to up the immigration?

All the best Alex - you are our best hope
57

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01/04/2008 08:26:40
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01/04/2008 08:27:19
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01/04/2008 08:32:19
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Gusto,

01/04/2008 08:35:11
Well, I hope Salmond's pronounciation was better than Hamish's spelling. (or should we pronounce that Hammish?)
I'm sure the "Celtic Lion" will roar if they loose the league...
61

Liberal for life,

Dunblane 01/04/2008 08:38:15
Looks like more public money will be spent (wasted) on attracting overseas companies to camp for a few years in our country, take our IP knowledge and wave goodbye. A total rethink on how local indigenous ideas from our scientists and engineers are brought to market has to be constructed.

As a further example, at present government funded agencies are devising procurement strategies that will probably work against the SME type companies that comprise the economy of the UK and wider Europe, despite what the politicians say when they encourage local businesses to grow. This represents a total lack of joined-up thinking as the indigenous private SME companies struggle to survive against the global players.
62

Ampro De Glasgow,

Aberdeen 01/04/2008 08:42:09
71.John Q Scrotum-Bottom the second, an SNP voter,01/04/2008 08:27:19

32 John Q Scrotum-Bottom the second, an SNP voter,01/04/2008 02:03:58


Well it shows us all what sort of life this apologist of a Unionist is. He survives on little more than 6 and a half hours of sleep and then he jumps out of bed to post more of his immature propaganda on this website. I suspect that he is AM2 because he is the only other person with this sort of sad stamina.

His posts say more about his state of mind than anything else. Who ever this poster is has little to live for in his life, sad, pathetic and should be ignored.
63

Ampro De Glasgow,

Aberdeen 01/04/2008 08:43:52
74
You are an old man so why are you concerning yourself with overseas investment. You have your state pension now shut up.
64

Charley,

Dubai 01/04/2008 08:51:09
Maybe a meaow to start. This guy has never run a business let alone a country. I'm not sure I believe anyhting these guys say because they've all said the same before....to get your votes! Wake up people.
65

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01/04/2008 08:51:58
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01/04/2008 08:54:28
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01/04/2008 08:56:14
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01/04/2008 09:00:56
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01/04/2008 09:01:58
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Nikostratos,

01/04/2008 09:04:35
"on his success in growing Scotland's economy"

no mention about the people who manage and work in the 'real economy' It's all done by Alex Salmond on his own......
71

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01/04/2008 09:07:31
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01/04/2008 09:08:06
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Dougie Douglas,

British 01/04/2008 09:09:43
Scrotum by name, Scrotum....

Are you the vanguard of the unionist bloggers fightback?

Your bravery in the face of such adversity is an example to all other would-be labour trolls.

Marvellous stuff, keep it coming - your blowing them away

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01/04/2008 09:26:27
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01/04/2008 09:33:31
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01/04/2008 09:34:58
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01/04/2008 09:35:58
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Doh,

01/04/2008 09:36:05


We will know that we are roaring when American politicians start visiting Scotland to encourage
inward investment in the USA.

Far fetched or only one or two generations away?
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01/04/2008 09:37:36
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01/04/2008 09:40:11
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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 09:42:18
For the first time in a very long time, The Hootsman actually reported this as news with no snide, negative comments from the opposition.

Quietly amazed I turn to the comments and there we have it #2 covered in cringe and despondency that Scotland might embrace ambition, the thinking man's Lord Foulke's with just the right trace of bitterness.

Well done AM2, your family must be delighted to see your cheery demeanour of a morning.
82

Miss H,

01/04/2008 09:45:42
5 AM2 that's quite simple. By allowing people to keep more of their own money you not only increase the amount of disposable income they have but you decrease the numbers of people getting over their heads into debt.

83

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 01/04/2008 09:46:25
What a refreshing change from the narrow focus on the deprived, vulnerable and very young to a topic which will help to actually pay for these necessary expenses. Also a nice change from the moaning minnies in Labour who can only mump on about the SNP and how they were robbed and how "socialist" they are now. You bet - so socialist we'll be back to the 19th century before you know it.

More of the same from Mr Salmond cannot go wrong.
84

Alan B,

01/04/2008 09:48:35
AM2 ur posts seem to get more desparate by the day.

U ask a poster for some honesty while misrepresenting things urself (#5).

#2 Re: "...to match the growth rates of small independent countries like Ireland and Iceland by 2017"
Please, no! Ireland's annualised GNP growth was just 1.2% in Q4 2007 and Iceland's economy will barely grow at all this year.

This really is pathetic. Ireland growth has been amazing over a period of over 15yrs. Any economy will grow faster some yrs than others. Anyone with a brain knows u judge an economy over a period of yrs.

As u seem blissfully unaware. (i do not think u are, u are just happy to misreprent things because ur argument is so poor. I will explain.

Luxembourg, Ireland, Norway, Iceland, Switzerland, Austria, Denmark, Netherlands, Finland have all got higher gpd per capitas than the uk. And scotland has we know has performed worse than the rest of the uk.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita

So are honestly saying no to being a richer nation. Atleast u are honest about the price of the union. Stay with the union and be poorer.

"But at least it's good to see Mr Salmond being up-front about the fact that Scotland has the ability to grow strongly within the United Kingdom."

Again u know fine what Salmond has said. He said he would try to bring growth in scotland up to UK levels from its poor growth rates that it has posted over a period of decades. He also stated that to bring Scotland up to the higher standard of the small european countries we would need the tools of independence.
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01/04/2008 09:54:07
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Alan B,

01/04/2008 09:56:09
#5 "I supported the business rate cut"

Why do support a business rate cut and not corporation tax cut? Symbolically a corporation tax cut means so much more.

U supported a corporation tax cut in the summer but then reversed ur opinion. At the time u stated that scotland could match superb ireland economic growth within the uk if scotland matched irelands corporation tax.

However u then reversed ur position when it was pointed out
1)that unionist parties were saying it was inconsistent with eu law and we might need to be independent to implement ur own solution to scotlands economic woes.
2)it was inconistent with ur own position that the barnett formula was a good reason for staying with the union as ur own policy would have meant it would have to be abolished.

That is part of ur problem. Ur like a political party more interested in posting half truths and misrepresentations rather than making any coherent arguements one way or the other.

87

Unimpressed one,

01/04/2008 09:57:31
This is a hootsman April fool sendup, no?
88

Tweedmouth,

Coldstream 01/04/2008 09:58:56
There is a historic memorial tablet in St Giles Cathedral - which I recall as being on the East side of the building - inside.
It commemorates the life od some great Scot with a beautifully carved crest and the words
"acta non verba"

"Deeds - not words"

Salmond has been in power for quite some time now - the only 'enterprise' we have seen encouraged is to trample all over the planning laws in the attempt to allow a vile American super-capitalist to build 500 luxury houses in a nature reserve in Aberdeenshire. This would break every planning law in Scotland and would undoubtedly be blocked by European law. But it shows the poverty of imagination that the only serious money to be invited in is Donald Trump - one of the most reviled men in America.
89

pwd,

Hawick 01/04/2008 09:59:22
* 59 Dekester

"Yet we have this self doubt that is at our very core."

Wrong! Some separatists may feel a bit inadequate and uncertain about who they are but the rest of have no doubt that we are British and we feel perfectly at ease with that.
90

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01/04/2008 10:00:00
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 10:03:56
2. AM2 Re: "...to match the growth rates of small independent countries like Ireland and Iceland by 2017"

Please, no! Ireland's annualised GNP growth was just 1.2%"

Cherrypicking, from AM2?

Strange, AM2 doesn't mention the fact that Scotland's growth rate pver the past 25 years (not as representative as 1 quarter's figures of course) was just 1.8% while Irelands was 7.2%, and the average of small European countries was 3.6%.
92

 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 10:04:36
105. LOL. That was fast
93

brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 10:05:23
94 Amparo

He's back under another disguise and its going to be difficult to spot which one.

78 Charley

And your alternative would be...?
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01/04/2008 10:06:43
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AJ Fife,

01/04/2008 10:21:08
I think a grudging respect is now showing from the 'Hootsmon' and our regular Unionists, for the increasingly statesman-like Mr Salmond.

You can't knock the man's honest endeavour and energy in promoting Scottish interests.

I think we(Nationalists, Unionists and Libdems)should all unite together and thank Mr Salmond for making Scotland a brighter and more prosperous country.
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01/04/2008 10:22:04
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 10:22:21
110. LOL. That was even faster
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01/04/2008 10:31:36
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Jock 107,

01/04/2008 10:33:46
112

"Honest"! LOL! looking for another trump, maybe(and no bad thing)
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 10:34:13
116. AH, jutt some sad case getting all his posts deleted.

Hey, that is the wrong one, sniff sniff
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 10:36:17
117 - it was over before it began, LOL
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Why can't I use my usual name?,

01/04/2008 10:48:17
#1-#120... what a lot about not much at all. Get lives!
105

Sedov,

Barnsley 01/04/2008 10:54:35
I do not want us to roar like a lion, can we just be like wee Denmark and be low profile but effective please? After all the NATS keep chucking the example of "independent" Denmark down everyones throat and they don't have a "Denmark Day" in the USA as far as I know.
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 10:56:18
122. Ssssh, I am scuba diving in a jacuzzi
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01/04/2008 10:57:58
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Neil,

9% Growth, Glasgow 01/04/2008 11:00:09
He is quite right that achieving a "Celtic Lion" economy, a mach for Ireland's Celtic Tiger", should be the "defining mission" of his government. hat, not independence, is the promise that got him elected. However that means matching Ireland's big cat like growth rate of 7% not merely England's of 2.5%

We know exactly how to achieve this because Ireland did - dramatically lower business rates, corporation tax & general business costs; reduced planning & regulatory restrictions, particularly in the building industry; a reduction in the 55% of Scotland's economy being state spending; 3p off income tax wouldn't hurt; neither would not making the lights go out; or getting costs of public projects like the Forth crossing down to what other countries manage.

All of these are easily affordable, indeed several would save money.

It is time for Alex to stop merely promising & deliver.
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Neil,

Glasgow 01/04/2008 11:00:23
He is quite right that achieving a "Celtic Lion" economy, a mach for Ireland's Celtic Tiger", should be the "defining mission" of his government. hat, not independence, is the promise that got him elected. However that means matching Ireland's big cat like growth rate of 7% not merely England's of 2.5%

We know exactly how to achieve this because Ireland did - dramatically lower business rates, corporation tax & general business costs; reduced planning & regulatory restrictions, particularly in the building industry; a reduction in the 55% of Scotland's economy being state spending; 3p off income tax wouldn't hurt; neither would not making the lights go out; or getting costs of public projects like the Forth crossing down to what other countries manage.

All of these are easily affordable, indeed several would save money.

It is time for Alex to stop merely promising & deliver.
110

Scotland to prosper...,

01/04/2008 11:03:01
What tripe is posted on here sometimes.

The fact is, I'd far rather Salmond promote Scotland using phrases like "lion economy" rather than McConnell’s embarrassing message "Best wee nation..blah blah"

And for those who argue that Salmond has been in Government for some time and not made much impact, I’m sorry, I guess Student Endowment fees scrapped themselves and prescription charges were cut of their own accord.

Now for the cracker, the argument of economic growth. Where’s the benefit of staying in the UK? Scotland grows at a LESSER rate than the UK average, we have two of the poorest areas in Europe, we are the worst performing small country in Western Europe and we still have the “sick man of EU” label.

It sickens me the views some Scots have with regards to their nation. Why wouldn’t Scotland be a prosperous nation? Why wouldn’t Scotland be able to accelerate its economic growth? How can we be satisfied with the status quo?

I’d wish some of these people (AM2 and the like) would take a walk round the poorer areas of Scotland, see the deprivation that is bordering on criminal, and explain to me the benefits these people are receiving by being part of the UK?
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Mr Custard,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 11:09:20
He still bangs about this stupid lion. There's no such thing as 'Lion economy'!
112

Why can't I use my usual name?,

Glasgow 01/04/2008 11:09:30
No poor parts of Dublin then, #128?
113

Dougie Douglas,

Brisbane 01/04/2008 11:12:37
9% Growth

You say:-

"It is time for Alex to stop merely promising & deliver"

Er, so what do you think he is doing in America?

Can you imagine if the tables were turned - i.e. the SNP had a US Tartan Week concentrating on the kitsch aspects of Scottishness then a new labour Government (sorry that would be 'Executive') came to power, changed the name of the week to one that more Americans can understand (Tartan is 'Plaid' in the states), focused it on inward investement, increased it's scope to major economic cities all over America and did it for half the price.

You unionists really need to take a very large smell of the coffee
114

Anglofile,

01/04/2008 11:16:37
81
"Alex may well be the greatest scot every to have drawn breath"

That appears to be the major problem, that AS is still drawing breath.

So they have changed the theme from Tartan week to Scotland week so that the Yanks can understand!!!!!! Wonderful.

Also mentions that invited guests and "affinity" Scots, people who already are aware of Scotland will attend.

Why doesn't he just get that 4 ft anti semetic australian to dress up like a Scotsman in stilts and shout a few well chosen phrases?

Yanks would lap that up!!!!
115

Dougie Douglas,

Brisbane 01/04/2008 11:23:38
#128

Exactly.

The unionists are totally bankrupt when it comes to debating this as the silver tongued #130 shows.

AM2 ,though I respect his politeness when posting, really is one slippery character and really does represent the broken record of unionist thought being utterly deceptive with statistics is his modus operandi.

AM2 states Ireland has an economic growth rate of 1.2% per quarter. He does not extend this into an annual figure - 4.8%. Scotlands annual growth is 1.8%. So to put it another way they grow more than us in 4 months than we do in a year.

20 years ago the same bleating glass half full unionists pointed at Ireland and said 'if you want Independence that is what will happen' (you'll become poor).

Give me a glass of Irish anyday.


116

Dougie Douglas,

Brisbane 01/04/2008 11:30:51
Just another one for the unionists:-

You claim that Scotland would suffer economically if Independent - yes?

Lets assume within a year of the day the economy shrunk by 10% - yes?

Lets assume that Scotland would enjoy the same economic growth as other small European countries (3.7% as opposed to Scottish growth - 1.8%) (unless you believe we do not possess this ability to perform equally as good as others)

Scotland would have regained her economic standing within 3 years.

Unionist figures do not stack up.
117

Border Scot,

01/04/2008 11:34:57
#127 - You hit the nail on the head. To grow like Ireland, Scotland needs an economic policy like Ireland's - thus: lower taxation and a muc smaller state sector, probably meaning an end to our cradle to grave welfare state and significant numbers of redundancies among workers employed by the state.

But when does the SNP or its leader ever spell these facts out to the Scottish people?

Alternatively, we could go the route of the Nordic countries and signiicantly raise levels of taxation. But, again, we are never told this by the SNP.

Wouldn't it be great if we could have some honesty in the independence debate. Yes, there are some small countries doing very well; but if we are to emulate them we must do as they do. One thing is certain, you cannot have a low tax economy and sustain the levels of public spending we currently have in Scotland.
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Border Scot,

01/04/2008 11:35:46
#134 - How do you get that growth Dougie?
119

Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 11:37:29
#128.
Scots could have given Salmond the absolute majority
in Holyrood in 2007 so that he could go to people with an independence referendum. They did not and would not
as the majority of scots are simply scared to cut the funding links to England. It is all very well talking about Oil income, inward investment and the like and they simply are not ready to vote for SNP in the secrecy of the voting booth. It is not England holding Scotland but the Scotland grasping England tight and did not let it go when they did not vote SNP as a majority party in 2007. Nationalists argue citing climbing percentage in polls and that they would do it next time but there is no sign that majority of Scots would listen to them to vote SNP in numbers to Holyrood.

SNP leader may say many things in the US but still at heart a socialist and Scotland has a large public sector and the US entrepreneurs would not make a bee line simply because he says so.

I should remind Salmond that surging economies are called Tiger economies.
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01/04/2008 11:40:51
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Border Scot,

01/04/2008 11:42:52
#137 - Or maybe most Scots are happy being a part of the UK for a number of reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with whether they get money or not from Westminster. maybe they believe, as I do, that together the countries of the UK are stronger than they are united; maybe they understand that scotland pays her way in any case through its contributions historically to the growth of the UK and in the present time through North Sea oil; maybe they believe that fundamentally much more unites the peoples of the UK than divides them; and maybe they believe that in the 21st century it maes more sense to expore how to bring borders down rather than to construct them. In fact, maybe most Scots actually think the same way as most people in England, Wales and Northern Ireland. I would not be too much of a surprise given that we share a common history, and so many cultural, social, linguistic, genetic and political ties.

Just a thought.
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01/04/2008 11:43:22
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Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 11:51:30
#139 Well said. My argument is that Scots have a major say how they would like to governed. Time and again they have demonstrated that they would like to be in the Union. England will let go Scotland if Scots voted otherwise,perid. Any blame directed against England by nationalists is not to grasp the fact that majority of Scots are not interested in idependence as demonstrated in the last election. Every Scot I know including some nationalists agree with this. Hence the nationalists' frustration. But they have to convince their fellow Scots to vote for them. The signs are that they are not suceeding, and independence hence perhaps 20-30 years away or may never happen. I am simply highlighting this.
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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 11:54:52
'There will be a referendum in 2010'

Wendy Alexander speaking to delegates at Apex International Hotel in Edinburgh September 8 2007

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2007/sep/09/comment.politics2


Other peaches from this interview.

'The talk in Holyrood is that she will fail, scuppered by a lack of charm. 'This could be a spectacular disaster,' said one observer. A frustrated supporter in the party confirmed: 'She just doesn't listen.'
130

OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 11:55:22
#146 Holds breath.
131

Border Scot,

01/04/2008 11:58:55
#147 - The one way to guarantee that nationalists will not prsuade fellow Scots to join them is to accuse them of being traitors, lickspittles, doing Scotland down, being afraid etc etc etc. What I would love to see is a propler discussion of what independence would actually mean in practical terms for Scottish people. We never seem to get that. Instead, all we get is promises of jam tomorrow because some other small countries have done well in recent years. But the simple fact is that post-industrial, cradle-to-grave welfare Scotland is not like other countries, and most Scots understand this, meaning that what works for Ireland or Denmark or Norway is not going to work here because the base from where we are starting is so completely different. If you throw in the cultural, social, political, linguistic, genetic and all the other ties we have the other countries of the UK, the case for independence is still far from made.

No-one ever says that Scotland could not be an independent country. The issue is whether it is in Scotland's best interests to be an independent country. Most of us are far from persuaded that it is.
132

Arfur,

01/04/2008 12:01:18
AM2 - I see it is another day of you having comments removed that you do not like. This is not your board it is everyones so can you please play nice.

So lets see what SNP have done today
(1) Reduce business tax rates
(2) Reduce prescription charges for everyone by £2
(3) Promoted Scotland to american companies

AM2 - you can not possibly say without a smile on your face that any of these are not good for Scotland.
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01/04/2008 12:03:01
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AJ Fife,

01/04/2008 12:13:42
Taggart#152,

LOL, didn't 'Smeato' make his involvement up, and the ensuing media roller coaster jist couldnae stop? He did appear to have a 'beamer' when he picked up aw his awards right enough!

Sounds like he's a perfect Labour politician in the making - a habitual liar and a brass neck!!!LOL
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European Scot,

01/04/2008 12:18:21
139 Border Scot

" maybe they understand that Scotland pays her way in any case through its contributions historically to the growth of the UK and in the present time through North Sea Oil;"

Please place your post next to this article about the McCrone report.
Consider the lies and deceit involved in keeping the information in this report secret from the people of Scotland for 30 years.

( The McCrone report article in the Independent 2005. )

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/this-britain/how-black-gold-was-hijacked-north-sea-oil-and-the-betrayal-of-scotland-518697.html

" Or maybe most Scots are happy being part of of the UK for a number of reasons..."

I don't think this would be one of them.
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Arfur,

01/04/2008 12:25:18
#155 Master Debator - AM2, Highland Mighty and Ayrshire Scot are all bad at having comments removed. I am however sure that AM2 and Highland Mighty are one and the same poster.
140

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 12:25:25
145. I was under the impression that 92% of all prescriptions are already free.

So all the SNP have done is give cheaper prescriptions for the wealthy.

What's so brilliant about that?
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Border Scot,

01/04/2008 12:25:30
#157 - The suppression of the McCrone report was a disgrace. But I believe most Scots see beyond North Sea oil in any case.
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brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 12:26:08
150 Border Scot

I cannot see any mention of traitors, lickspittle etc on this thread.

As for the "doing Scotland down" by the very nature of things by backing a retention of the union you are saying either we depend on England to support us or we have not got the intelligence, skills and desire to make a success of running our own country. If the efforts of Brown and Darling were to be typical of Scotland then we would all have to agree with you.

I think you will find that people in Scotland have woken up to the stagnation of our nation by repeated Tory/Labour/Tory/Labour self-seeking governments.

I think the 2007 elections are but the beginning of a Scotland awaking to its potential not for waging wars but for the development of the country as a self-governing entity.
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Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 12:26:38
#150 I agree completely with you and your clearly laid out comment. I should also add that Norway is outside the EU. The health service in the Irish Republic is different from the NHS model, and the same in Denmark. Denmark tends to vote socialists and conservatives in turn and there are chances for mitakes by one to be corrected by the other. Even then a very large prportion of Danish entreneurs have moved out of Denmark when socialist governments in succession taxed them to the hilt. One test for Salmond is what will he do if the 3% tax cap is lifted. That worries most of Scottish families I know.
144

Neil,

Glasgow 01/04/2008 12:29:13
131 said
"9% Growth

You say:-

"It is time for Alex to stop merely promising & deliver"

Er, so what do you think he is doing in America?"

Well not cutting business taxes, or regulations, or income tax, or stopping the lights going out here is he?

In fact he is doing almost exactly what McConnell did, which, since I am not a die hard unionist either is not praising him.

You fanatics who think separatism will make everything, up to & including the weather, better & consider pointing out that Alex does not walk on water are doing your cause no good.

he SNP are doing marginally better than Labour but could, should & were elected on a promise to produce the sort of sucess Ireland has managed & are not delivering.
145

 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 12:29:37
158. I haven't reported a single post and never do. I was just laughing at the muppet above posting drivel and his posts vanishing.
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Arfur,

01/04/2008 12:30:18
#159 - 92% of all prescriptions are already free??????????????
147

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 12:32:10
157. Nat Rule no.1: When you have nothing to say, mention the McCrone report. However...

1a. Ignore that it was written before a single drop of oil was pumped ashore.

1b. Ignore that its estimates were wildly wrong.

1c. Ignore that public accounts show oil taxation income averages only £4-6bn a year.

1d. Claim that any Govt accounts are faked even though this implicates every successive Govt since the 70s, the EU, the WTO, OPEC, the oil companies, the oil markets and the financial markets in a global conspiracy just to control Scottish nationalism. Which is ridiculous.

1e. Never ever provide your own oil income figure. Only ever dismiss figures provided by the above sources.
148

Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 12:32:36
165. In the last count over 80% of NHS prescriptions are free in England.
149

Arfur,

01/04/2008 12:33:11
#164 then you have my apologies. i am just fed up of people using this like it is their personal chat room.
150

Arfur,

01/04/2008 12:33:28
#164 then you have my apologies. i am just fed up of people using this like it is their personal chat room.
151

 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 12:34:12
159. The SNP have given cheaper, moving to free, prescriptions to everyone - alot of the people who will benefit are those working on low incomes who are not "wealthy".
152

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 12:35:53
165. From way back in 2006, long before the SNP did anything about prescriptions:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/4600678.stm

And also the last paragraph of this:

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/News/Releases/2007/12/05141211
153

Brian M,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 12:38:16
the effect of Council tax freeze, abolition of bridge tolls and reduction in prescription charges will be to release a sizable amount of money into the economy as opposed to the dead hand of government grabbing it
154

Angus Ogg,

01/04/2008 12:38:43
#10 AM2

Pretty much all of the time I am 180 degrees diametrically opposed to AM2's points of view.

However 2 things can be said of AM2.

1. He or she, or they are consistent, and should be given an award for longevity and persistence, in the line of fire.

2. Sometimes AM2 has an interesting point to make and makes it with a bit of flair.

Whatever your point of view, to turn nukes and ice scream into and rebukes and I screams is an interesting play on words.

Before the SNP were elected, these boards were often populated with interesting people with insightful points of view and open for debate.

I am very glad the SNP were elected. I changed my vote from Labour to SNP for 2007, and am impressed with the way Alex Salmond and his team have outshone and outclassed Jack and Wendy (sounds like a kids rhyme or something off the tellytubbies. In fact they looked like something off the tellytubbies).

However, sometime, in fact most of the time I yearn for a decent debate or an interesting, not-so-polarised thread on these boards.
155

Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 12:38:57
171. I appreciate your research and agree with your comments.
156

Angus Ogg,

01/04/2008 12:39:59
#10 AM2

Pretty much all of the time I am 180 degrees diametrically opposed to AM2's points of view.

However 2 things can be said of AM2.

1. He or she, or they are consistent, and should be given an award for longevity and persistence, in the line of fire.

2. Sometimes AM2 has an interesting point to make and makes it with a bit of flair.

Whatever your point of view, to turn nukes and ice scream into and rebukes and I screams is an interesting play on words.

Before the SNP were elected, these boards were often populated with interesting people with insightful points of view and open for debate.

I am very glad the SNP were elected. I changed my vote from Labour to SNP for 2007, and am impressed with the way Alex Salmond and his team have outshone and outclassed Jack and Wendy (sounds like a kids rhyme or something off the tellytubbies. In fact they looked like something off the tellytubbies).

However, sometime, in fact most of the time I yearn for a decent debate or an interesting, not-so-polarised thread on these boards.
157

Border Scot,

01/04/2008 12:41:06
#161 - I am saying neither of those things. I am saying that being a fully integated part of a G8 economy can work in Scotland's favour and that Scots can and do play a full part in deciding how the UK functions. I do not see the Scots as victims.

158

Border Scot,

01/04/2008 12:41:15
#161 - I am saying neither of those things. I am saying that being a fully integated part of a G8 economy can work in Scotland's favour and that Scots can and do play a full part in deciding how the UK functions. I do not see the Scots as victims.

159

OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 12:43:15
#155 Ah yes Ayrshire Scot that arch nemesis of Unionists everywhere, his practise of the dark arts are feared in every shadow of this unionist wonderland.

They seek him here they seek him there, that lavender debonaire.
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01/04/2008 12:43:21
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01/04/2008 12:44:17
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01/04/2008 12:44:31
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Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 12:45:35
179. But you say that every hour so what are the odds, eh!
164

European Scot,

01/04/2008 12:47:51
166 Highland Mighty

I have plenty to say, and I certainly don't need your patronising nonsense.
The reason the McCrone report is brought up is to also illustrate the fact that here was something that wasn't considered to be in the United Kingdom's interest, so it was buried.
It was however very much in Scotland's interests to know of its contents.
The point being as long as Scotland remains in the Union, decisions made in the 'national interest' won't necessarily be in the interest of Scotland.
Now if you want sensible mature argument, try showing some examples of it.
165

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 12:47:56
179. But you say that every hour so what are the odds, eh!
166

Angus Ogg,

01/04/2008 12:56:06
#10 AM2

Pretty much all of the time I am 180 degrees diametrically opposed to AM2's points of view.

However 2 things can be said of AM2.

1. He or she, or they, are consistent, and should be given an award for longevity and persistence in the line of fire.

2. Sometimes AM2 has an interesting point to make and makes it with a bit of flair.

Whatever your point of view, to turn nukes and ice scream into and rebukes and I screams is an interesting play on words.

Before the SNP were elected, these boards were often populated with interesting people with insightful points of view and open for debate.

I am very glad the SNP were elected. I changed my vote from Labour to SNP for 2007, and am impressed with the way Alex Salmond and his team have outshone and outclassed Jack and Wendy (sounds like a kids rhyme or something off the tellytubbies. In fact they looked like something off the tellytubbies).

However, sometime, in fact most of the time I yearn for a decent debate or an interesting, not-so-polarised thread on these boards.

Any takers ?
167

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01/04/2008 12:56:12
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01/04/2008 12:58:50
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01/04/2008 13:00:25
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01/04/2008 13:02:15
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Stu_R_20,

01/04/2008 13:04:08
Any attempt to shore up our economy with foreign investment must be welcomed, and to AM2, those are very specific figures you have used, the Irish economy has grown by almost 40% in the last two years (NOS). Scotland...certainaly not reaching its economic capacity, more regional economic policy is all that's needed, if the UK government had devolved fiscal autonomy to SCotland in 1997 alot of Salmond's arguments could be countered. However, they did not hence, support for him continues to grow and the next election will be an SNP landslide with the Tories making significant ground. Thankfully the electorate continue to shunt Alexander and Nicol (two of the most incompetent fools ever to be elected).
Infact if anyone is from Nicol's constituency perhaps they could enlighten me as to his continual re-election?? Or is he an 'additional member'?.
172

langtonian,

scotusl 01/04/2008 13:07:54
#28fifeisgreat

Right on the money -always have favoured this so straightforward solution.All parties have the oportunity to make their case as part of a total manifesto proposal.
Have always been at a loss to underastand why this sound ,up front,no shennanigans voting opotunity, has never been a main plank in every parties manifesto.

Probably because it is so appealing to the vast majority of voters.

Obfuscate is a much used tool by politicians who try to muddy the watters when their case is going against their expectations.

That is why a Referendum is appealing-it's not on!
173

Mr Custard,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 13:08:10
#188

and can you show me that the nationalists on this board are capable of any different? It seems mightly one-sided from where I'm standing.
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Mr Custard,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 13:08:18
#188

and can you show me that the nationalists on this board are capable of any different? It seems mightly one-sided from where I'm standing.
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01/04/2008 13:10:01
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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 13:10:34
#185 Angus, try and engage some of the unionists on here about things they love about Scotland and you're in for a very one sided conversation. SOME of them seem to view pride as a negative when referring to Scotland. It's a very odd condition.
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Upnorth,

Upnorth 01/04/2008 13:13:07
59-

“Believe it. The English would be terrified of a united and independent Scotland. Tens of thousands of ex-pats would be re-unified. What would become of jolly old England?”

This is perhaps how you would like to believe the future could be? I believe most English are mildly in favour of the union although some of course are not, a similar situation to that which exists in Scotland. If the English believed that the majority of Scots wanted to break up the Union, they would come around to the same way of thinking.

You can argue about whether Scotland subsidises England or visa versa, it’s something most English don’t care about. Don’t believe all the media hype about perceived injustices, the English are too busy getting on with their lives to worry about these minor things.

In the event of separation the impact on the English economy would be insignificant and they would have no more to fear of Scotland than any other small nation in the vicinity, e.g. Ireland, Norway etc.
178

OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 13:25:34
Err thanks for that Mr Side.
179

 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 13:28:07
173. Angus, agree, AM2 makes points of interest, often wittily and is polite, no matter how wrong he usually is.
As for use of language like "traitors", "quislings" "lickspittles" etc this is a sure sign or mentalism, does nothing for discussion and only encourages loons on both sides.
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 13:28:55
198. Lavender debonaire? :-)
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01/04/2008 13:30:08
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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 13:30:45
#200 Arf! I'm just presuming you never shopped at Sir Tam's Finest Shell Suit Emporium.
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justboy,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 13:34:11
Why do we feel the need to parade ourselves infront of corrupt regiemes like the US of A. Is tourism going to plug the 'local income tax blackhole' then? We dont need anymore queue jumping Americans visiting our country.
184

uranus,

Devon 01/04/2008 13:35:57
I am a retired Scotsman living in Devon. I wonder what these nationalists who post so many here and what they are doing at this of the day, can't be students, if they are they would be at the university or studying, can't be working, if they are they wouldn't find time to argue with posts after posts, can't be all retired and that leaves... Years ago I was like you dabled in nationalism, believed the SNP hyperboly, but later realised that they used us as the voting fodder. Looking at Salmond, comfortable with his waitband increasing, keeping still his Westminster seat, and as usual blaming English. All the arguments about Denmark and Ireland are spurious and the SNP has produced no verifiable figures about Scotand. Salmond would achieve nothing in USA, and this 'roaring like lion' is for the voters back in Scotalnd. Americans do not take him seriously. His supporter the James Bond
is living comfortably in sunny Bahamas says that he would come to independent Scotland but seriously he is sloganising like Salmond.

I do not get signs (I visit my native town Falkirk often)that scotland is ready for independence in the next decade. However SNP cajoles they will not get the necessary votes not in the near future perhaps never.
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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 13:36:40
What the chuff, wasn't #201 a bit on the innocuous side about Dark Side, Master, Kimba et al being one and the same? How fishy.
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 13:44:35
205. Yes it was.
187

Guga II,

Rockall 01/04/2008 13:52:51
I see the Hootsmon Censors (Pravda Branch) have been having a busy day to day. I also notice that a lot of the comments that have been removed are ones which query aspects of the rubbish posted by AM Squared.

Of course the Hootsmon Editor has denied that their rag, and most of their so-called journalists are biased towards the Unionists and the New Labour Sleaze and Corruption Party, but the removal of a lot of these posts shows this to be a lie.

My comment on AM Squared was also removed, but can be found in the comments section of the Herald. Their bias is not anywhere near as blatant as that of the Hootsmon.
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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 13:53:35
#206 There's an evil presence in the force and I suspect it has nothing to with the retired uranus at #204
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brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 13:54:02
197 in the dark

Thank you for your elegant and erudite contribution.

When you say Dear Leader do you mean the present First Minister who merely had talks with the Trump organisation or do you mean the Dear Departed Leader who helicopted-ferried him around Scotland and wined and dined him at much public expense?

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01/04/2008 13:58:40
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kimba,

01/04/2008 13:59:01
205. I can assure you the master and Dark side have nothing to do with me,however,I do agree with the majority of their postings;jeez,when you nats are wrong boy,you are really wrong.
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01/04/2008 14:00:20
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brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 14:15:42
210 Stepford

If by great you mean the more effective politican in Scotland at present then yes he is great.

211 The Dark

I take it you mean the openly declared and legal donation to the SNP and not the illegally hidden declarations to the Labour Party.
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Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 14:18:34
216 Brownlie

I think I do.. Are you one of us? If you are, then yes
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Dougie Douglas,

Brisbane 01/04/2008 14:22:06
Great post #214
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Sedov,

Scotland 01/04/2008 14:25:43
#204 uranus. As an ex SNP member ( for a short period) I entirely agree with you. I lived in England for 20 years and enjoyed every miniute of it, apart from occassional clashes with the BNP. I have came back to look after my mother otherwise I would still have been there. The English working person is just the same as us except that most of them have no axe to grind against the Scots unlike many of my fellow Scots who need to grow up and mature. The problem is that with the SNP promising utopia under "nationalism" and Salmonds attitude toward England the nastiness against the English in my opinion is growing and my English wife can voutch for this. I love my country and I am proud to be Scots but if the nationalist con their way to independence then its ta ta Scotland not just for me but for many of my friends. Fortunately I do not think the Scottish people will ever vote for independence and I will be doing my utmost to ensure the demise of the NATS and more powers to the devolved parliament.
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Sedov,

Scotland 01/04/2008 14:25:55
#204 uranus. As an ex SNP member ( for a short period) I entirely agree with you. I lived in England for 20 years and enjoyed every miniute of it, apart from occassional clashes with the BNP. I have came back to look after my mother otherwise I would still have been there. The English working person is just the same as us except that most of them have no axe to grind against the Scots unlike many of my fellow Scots who need to grow up and mature. The problem is that with the SNP promising utopia under "nationalism" and Salmonds attitude toward England the nastiness against the English in my opinion is growing and my English wife can voutch for this. I love my country and I am proud to be Scots but if the nationalist con their way to independence then its ta ta Scotland not just for me but for many of my friends. Fortunately I do not think the Scottish people will ever vote for independence and I will be doing my utmost to ensure the demise of the NATS and more powers to the devolved parliament.
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connaughtboy,

stonehaven 01/04/2008 14:26:30
#159 HM

You are a mighty fool to post such uninformed rubbish.
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 14:28:02
220. What is Salmond's attitude to the English? The debate would be better served if people didn't post such garbage as this.
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john z,

edinburgh 01/04/2008 14:28:47
I see our first minister, is doing what he should do, pushing for american investment in the Scottish economy. This is what Scotland needs a first minister to do. Put Scotland first.

Unlike the previous leader of the minority labour administration, Jack McConnell, who merely flounced about in an ill fitting (and ill advised) pin stripe skirt.

Hasn't wendy got something stupid to say on this??
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Dougie Douglas,

Brisbane 01/04/2008 14:32:29
Sedov - that was quick you were in Lancashire a couple of hours ago!

You have had bashes with the BNP? - what with you being Scottish?

My that's hospitable of them isn't it?

There are bigots and hot heads everywhere, Scotland has no more than it's fair share, like England.

You are pushing the myth of the SNP being anti-English.

It's such a base and weak unionist bit of mud slinging.

Get a life.
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connaughtboy,

stonehaven 01/04/2008 14:34:37
#171 HM

Exactly. The last paragraph states that 50% of the population qualifies for free prescriptions not that 92% of prescriptions are free as you claimed.
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john z,

edinburgh 01/04/2008 14:34:47
Number 67, John s

I couldn't agree more. Why is it, that Scotland is denounced regularly in Westminster as being a huge drain on England, and yet, time after time, the leaders in Westminster do everything in their power, using every nefarious dirty trick, manipulating the media, to keep Scotland from independence. It just doesn't add up.

Unless you consider the oil.
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connaughtboy,

stonehaven 01/04/2008 14:41:17
#204 uranus

I can't recall Salmond "blaming the English".

I have heard him criticise the politicians at Westminster. Is that what you meant?
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brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 14:51:44
204 uranus

I really don't see what Salmond's waistline has to do with an independence debate. I think remarks like that debases the poster and anything else they say becomes irrelevant. Please do not mistake an ambition for self-governing in Scotland with hatred of the English. You may get the occasional bigot in Scotland but no more so than in the rest of the UK society.
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kimba,

01/04/2008 14:56:48
224.Maybe you and your nat cronies need to "get a life" whilst the going is still good,'cause when salmond is done with you all there will be squat left.
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Miss H,

01/04/2008 15:07:15
230 Oh my, another prize loony.

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Miss H,

01/04/2008 15:07:20
230 Oh my, another prize loony.

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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 15:33:38
Master Debater's father was possibly an American Sailor who frequented the madames du pave in the demi-monde of Greenock, when the fleet was in. His errant spoffing created a mentalist.

That is an established fact.

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Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 15:35:56
235 Karinxxii
Me too - totally innocent, but culled by a moderator. All I said was Alex is brill (and he is too, isn't he)
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Saruman,

01/04/2008 15:37:48
Wake up, America! There’s no need to worry about the emerging economic powerhouse that is China: there’s a portly fellow with a popular touch who’s intent on doing the same thing for Skaatland! Just please don’t turn on him: he’s in no way to be mistaken for a threat to world peace!
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Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 15:37:52
240 Oscar
Are you suggesting that he's prejudiced against mentals? He probably is - typical unionist
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brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 15:48:17
How sad was all that?
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Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 15:52:26
291 Brownlie
It reminded me to take some time to read up on our policies. They're brilliant!
www.snp.org
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Saoghal Beag,

01/04/2008 15:52:51
he was obviously focused on what his other hand was doing, pair bairn what has scottish education come to?

nice to see the moderator's on the ball, on something anyway.
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Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 15:57:53
301 Master

My hero! (well, just after Alex)
xxx
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Saoghal Beag,

01/04/2008 16:00:48
305 your talents know no begining
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01/04/2008 16:07:10
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kimba,

01/04/2008 16:07:56
307.Only one problem,it wasn't me who posted that dribble,nice try,just goes to show how pathetic you nats are!
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01/04/2008 16:10:01
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 16:16:23
No, after the crimbliest, flakiest outbreak of unionist mentalism above, where are those people who were calling for civilised discussion?
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01/04/2008 16:21:27
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Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 16:21:36
311 Ayrshire Scott

Is a unionist mentalist someone who doesn't like unions and mentals?
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01/04/2008 16:24:29
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kimba,

01/04/2008 16:25:56
311. We try,but all we get is abuse,or some fakey troll who gets there kicks out of pretending to be who they are not!
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 16:43:02
318. Unionist loony tunes Spooky, the moderator is clearing them out, and about time! Kimba was posting some real dribble above.
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kimba,

01/04/2008 16:44:55
318,spook.guess they can't help being mentally challenged;how are things in spook land
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MacShimidh,

High Ground 01/04/2008 16:47:39

Thocht for the day:

Never make the mistake of arguing with people for whose opinions you have no respect." -- Edward

Gibbon (1737-1794)
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01/04/2008 16:49:46
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 16:52:10
323, ok
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 17:08:21
332 WHat did you say? (in outline?)

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Miss H,

01/04/2008 17:12:47
220 Sedov - your mentality defies description.

If Scotland ever becomes independent instead of being governed from Westminster you will leave will you? Why is that? The only conclusion is that it is because you don't think the Scots people can be trusted to govern themselves. You're like Prince Philip asking Jomo Kenyatta 'are you sure you want to go through with this?'

But the funniest thing of all is that you genuinely believe you are a left winger when you're outlook is actually a product of the worst kind of imperialism.

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Beam me up Scotty,

01/04/2008 17:13:46
I am surprised Salmond caused thi smuch controversy on a newspaper site.

Okay, I'll be the first to admit how pointless and irrelevant his speech was. But this kind of pointless grandstanding and empty rhetoric has become the norm for our well fed friends in power.

There shouldn't really be a fuss.
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European Scot,

01/04/2008 17:14:15
Mr Moderator, in your haste to remove the dross some spotty faced little nerd posted in abundance on this site, you unfortunately removed of one of the most reasonable comments I have seen on here for some time.
Why on earth was post 233 removed ?
It was written by an Englishman who had moved to Galloway, and he wrote in a most positive way about Scotland, his neighbours and the moves towards Independence.

He did write about the need to remove colonialism, and that he voted SNP.
Ah..........

No further questions.
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Nikostratos,

01/04/2008 17:15:21
#327Methalions,01/04/2008 16:50:54
"This is all becoming pointless"

You only just realised.....Me i love pointless it is just for the 'craic' ..............
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01/04/2008 17:16:53
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 17:20:09
340? School? OAP drop in centre, is Niko....
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Beam me up Scotty,

01/04/2008 17:22:38
341 Ayrshire Scot

Could you stop posting pointless and irrelevant nonsense?

It will just descend into chaos. You are one of the constant trolls here. Sniping at people, reporting posts and that kind of thing.

Everyone is embarassed by your presence and wishes you would stop your constant dross.
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 Ayrshire Scot™,

01/04/2008 17:24:07
342. x x x
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MoClana,

Stirling 01/04/2008 17:26:13
It never ceases to amaze me how much attention AM2 in these postings gets...his comments are designed purley to argue white against black and left from right (in no polictical sense) but the bottom line is that he is a blinkered Unionist with a blind hatred for Independence, no more no less and will cherry pick what arguments he feels safe within whilst ignoring the apparent logic of the Scottish Goverment.

I like the bit about how he' supported business rates cuts' ....oh well thank goodness we can all rest easy now that AM2 has given his blessing..bwahahaha he has been on this so much and been given so much undue attention that he is now dilusional...he actually thinks he's in power

This was my first and last reply to you AM2, a nice fellow im sure but increasingly confused. You need to get away from your P.C and mix with real people.
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Saruman,

01/04/2008 17:30:56
#335 Beam me up: I hate to say it, but the Nats are a bit like me in the pub when I get really steaming. Everybody’s heard all my shocking stories and opinions many times, so it just doesn’t have the impact it would have otherwise. The Nats spout so much negativity and are so full of imagined grievances that it just washes off the people of Scotland, allowing them to vote for them on account of their non separation policies (broken promises and all!) and cover their ears when they start on about the independence agenda. At least that’s the only explanation I can come up with for the Nats’ current popularity…
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Andrew Allan,

01/04/2008 17:59:11
#335., Beam me up Scotty. 01/04/2008 17:13:46
‘I am surprised Salmond caused thi smuch controversy on a newspaper site.
Okay, I'll be the first to admit how pointless and irrelevant his speech was. But this kind of pointless grandstanding and empty rhetoric has become the norm for our well fed friends in power.
There shouldn't really be a fuss.’

Well beam me up Scotty, you would be completely correct to say that Alex Salmond’s speech was pointless and irrelevant if it had been addressed towards a unionist audience. But p-unionists apart when a Scottish politician stands up abroad and talks about Britain then Scotland is rarely spoken up for, yet when Alex Salmond speaks he always speaks up for our nation. Far better then that Scotland is on the full time agenda politically than merely an after thought.

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Truely English,

01/04/2008 18:07:44
For more than two weeks I have been taking a deep interest in what is written on this site about Scotland. I have also read many different articles and items about the country on the internet to see how different the Scots are from the English. It is difficult to see what differences there are and can only conclude that they are miniscule and hardly worth mentioning.

Lots of people say the two countries are different or not the same but most of those who have lived in both seem to suggest that the differences are minor.

Yes, of course there are differences in Britain as there is in every area of the world but do these create a climate for breaking up Britain; I think not.

Probably the most disturbing aspect has been the Scots dislike or hatred of Gaelic speakers, their culure and religious practices which I find to be a great worry for us all.

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Truely English,

01/04/2008 18:07:56
For more than two weeks I have been taking a deep interest in what is written on this site about Scotland. I have also read many different articles and items about the country on the internet to see how different the Scots are from the English. It is difficult to see what differences there are and can only conclude that they are miniscule and hardly worth mentioning.

Lots of people say the two countries are different or not the same but most of those who have lived in both seem to suggest that the differences are minor.

Yes, of course there are differences in Britain as there is in every area of the world but do these create a climate for breaking up Britain; I think not.

Probably the most disturbing aspect has been the Scots dislike or hatred of Gaelic speakers, their culure and religious practices which I find to be a great worry for us all.

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Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 18:33:42
Celtic Lion? What the hell!
Is this man for real? He speaks more drivel than any Freedom Fighter has ever spoken, and he is out of touch with what the people want. All Salmond knows is what he wants, and of course, he has the support of the Freedom Front masses who would support him no matter what he did.

Salmond and all his degrees, Mugabe and his degrees! Freedom Fighters eh.
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Andrew Allan,

01/04/2008 18:38:22
#351.,Truely English. 01/04/2008 18:07:56
‘For more than two weeks I have been taking a deep interest in what is written on this site about Scotland. I have also read many different articles and items about the country on the internet to see how different the Scots are from the English. It is difficult to see what differences there are and can only conclude that they are miniscule and hardly worth mentioning.
Lots of people say the two countries are different or not the same but most of those who have lived in both seem to suggest that the differences are minor.
Yes, of course there are differences in Britain as there is in every area of the world but do these create a climate for breaking up Britain; I think not.
Probably the most disturbing aspect has been the Scots dislike or hatred of Gaelic speakers, their culure and religious practices which I find to be a great worry for us all.’

There is a Scottish saying that we are all Jock Tamson’s children, and in many ways this is a good indication of a philosophical difference between the people north and south of the border, as Scots have always believed in the team, where as the English have had a tendency towards the individual. In football history this is how the two countries played the sport until the meeting of the two nations, when the Scottish combination style was preferred and taken up, so the modern game of football. For most of our similarities you really have to look back to the Scottish Enlightenment, for that is when the great minds of Scotland created what is now known a modernity in the sense as we know it, it was Scottish ideas of running affairs from education to economics to politics etc which drew are peoples together. Yet in one of the most important elitism against anti-elitism, the English still lean towards individualism against the Scottish belief of the team approach. It was Scots who pushed for all to be called british, but the English held up the union flag and called it English. T
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Enigma,

01/04/2008 18:40:46
59

`Scots have had a huge influence on the World, as Scots not British`.

Rubbish, as enthusiastic participants in the British Empire.

`The English are afraid of a united independent Scotland`

More nonesense, but then expats often have delusions of grandeur.
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Andrew Allan,

01/04/2008 18:41:59
#354., mel.gibson@SNP.org.uk
I think you will find that we are against unfavourable impact by those who do not give a s**t.
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Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 18:42:16
If you fell in love with the Scotch, you better get to the Alcoholics Anonomous! Scotch is a drink san!
Away n beil yer heid man, we are a union people with a long standing relationship with our neighbours in N.Ireland, Wales and England. Together the four of us are a powerful nation, seperate we are nothing but passionate losers.
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Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 18:42:38
If you fell in love with the Scotch, you better get to the Alcoholics Anonomous! Scotch is a drink san!
Away n beil yer heid man, we are a union people with a long standing relationship with our neighbours in N.Ireland, Wales and England. Together the four of us are a powerful nation, seperate we are nothing but passionate losers.
324

Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 18:42:47
209
Exactly. He just had talks, he was never confused.
He's great, isn't he?
[this post was previously at 210, and was deleted by a tyrannical moderator]
325

tha mi,

01/04/2008 18:44:31
andrew alan for you to say that Probably the most disturbing aspect has been the Scots dislike or hatred of Gaelic speakers, their culure and religious practices which I find to be a great worry for us all.

Is proably the most ill conceived idea i have ever had the misfortune to read.

Speaking as a scot and a gaelic learner i find my class to be full of scots and english people so thats nonsense.

326

tha mi,

01/04/2008 18:49:02
andrew allan my apologies i realise now that it was in fact 351 who made the comment.
327

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brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 18:54:43
351 My Truely Truely Fair

I am Scottish and I don't hate Gaelic speakers.

Cia mar a tha thu a nochd?

Oh no I've just realised I'm one.

Tha gaol agam air Sassanaich!!!
332

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01/04/2008 18:54:58
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Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 18:55:07
The SNP are not a political party, they are a Freedom Fighting Movement! And that is the biggest problem in this debacle! Slowly but surely the SNP are doing what all freedom fighters do, they wake up to the realisation that they are not politicians and running a nation is a lot more intense, important and difficult than they thought they knew.
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01/04/2008 18:56:45
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Brian M,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 18:59:08
The dead hand of Labour has held Scotland back for decades with the so-called 'Scottish' Labour party taking orders from their English bosses, even after devolution.

It's too late for them and the likes of their new born socialist leader Red Wendy to continue with their pretence that they have any genuine concern for the people of Scotland
338

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01/04/2008 18:59:51
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Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 19:05:51
tha mi

Political parties dont fight for freedom, they govern within the context of that nations political arena! Salmond is speaking about Celtic Lions instead of speaking about Scotland. He cannot leave the hatred behind, he cannot leave England out of his agenda, he cannot accept that Scotland is part of the union.
He is fighting for freedom in a nation already free. Go figure
343

mel.gibson@SNP.org.uk,

01/04/2008 19:08:53
Of course the SNP are a political party. They got rid of their extremest and ciolent associates many, many decades ago.

This loin economy is going to be fab. I can feel the difference already.
344

brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 19:09:53
375 Tha mi math air Gaidhlig!

Feasgar math! good luck with the lessons - we need all the speakers we can get.
345

Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 19:09:55
Methalions

Ok, The SNP are a political party, but their leaders are freedom fighters..

The ANC won the election in SA in 1994! Pity the freedom fighters in charge are currently destroying the nation and the people they pretended to care for.

Didnt the Zanu PF win the election in Zim? That is right, but then Mugabe the freedom fighter realised how difficult it was to run a nation.

We are a union people, we are British!
346

Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 19:10:23
Methalions

Ok, The SNP are a political party, but their leaders are freedom fighters..

The ANC won the election in SA in 1994! Pity the freedom fighters in charge are currently destroying the nation and the people they pretended to care for.

Didnt the Zanu PF win the election in Zim? That is right, but then Mugabe the freedom fighter realised how difficult it was to run a nation.

We are a union people, we are British!
347

Hamish Scott,

01/04/2008 19:13:39
#373
tha mi - thanks for the link - maybe this is the way to unregister from the Scotsman, they don't seem to give you that option!
348

Hamish Scott,

01/04/2008 19:15:49
#384
"He is fighting for freedom in a nation already free. Go figure"

Media1 - so we are free to introduce a local income tax?
349

Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 19:17:55
Methalions

I dont trust him, not one iota!

I have NOTHING against independence as long as the people get to decide it on a YES or NO vote!
I would warm to a leader who was more intent on running Scotland within the context of the union whilst pushing ONLY for a referendum on independence. I would trust a man who wanted a YES or NO referendum, and Salmond isnt that man.
I see Salmond as a man with a personal agenda! He is a wee boy who does not like the English, and if he isnt that is how he comes across.
He reminds me of the Scottish people who wear Argentina strips when England play the Argentines! He reminds of a man who would not accept the results of a referendum against independence.
I dont dislike him because I dont know him. But I dont trust him, not at all.
350

Media 1,

cape town 01/04/2008 19:20:52
Hamish

When you are part of a partnership, you dont make decisions on your own, you remember you are part of a team and that the sum of the whole is greater than the parts it is made up from.
351

Hamish Scott,

01/04/2008 19:22:02
#394
media1 - I'll take that as a 'no' then.
352

mel.gibson@SNP.org.uk,

01/04/2008 19:23:37
I see there was another tragic account of Northern SNP party members assaulting strangers and writing SNP on their foreheads with portable tattoo guns.

I really think it's about time the SNP expelled the guilty parties for doing that.
353

Miss H,

01/04/2008 19:31:03
374 Actually what has been a revelation for me (even as a party member) is how good the SNP Government is. Or maybe it is just that it has become much more obvious how rubbish Labour was.

This is the day that a lot of the Government's policies come into effect - graduate endowment scrapped, prescription charges reduced, business rates reduced, council tax frozen.

Meanwhile Labour are still struggling to come to terms with opposition.....
354

Hamish Scott,

01/04/2008 19:38:50
#386
The SNP has always been a non-violent democratic party.

#396
You need to be careful here -
You are claiming to be a well known person, using a false email address linking you officially with the SNP, and claiming the party's supporters have engaged in a violent act. All these are actionable.
355

mel.gibson@SNP.org.uk,

01/04/2008 19:44:46
398

I need to be careful about someone mistaking me for Mel Gibson (Braveheart) being a member of the SNP and chatting with plebs like you from my bevery hills mansion on a scotsman website claiming that I go to SNP meetings and see them tattooing members of the public forceably with "SNP" on their foreheads.

I see. What will the test in court be? Would an average person believe this was true?

What is your IQ sonny? 79?
356

Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 19:44:54
397
Yes it came as a revelation to me too! How marvellous!
Alex is brill, isn't he? And, as you say, labour is sooo rubbish!
357

brownlie,

glasgow 01/04/2008 19:47:19
394 Media 1

It's interesting that you should say we are part of a team.

David Porter, a BRITISH Broadcasting Corporation political reporter, reporting on the rift between the Scottish Government and the UK Government said that some English people were complaining that Scottish people were getting more funding than other parts of England. The BBC will be calling us Scotlandshire next.
358

Jock 107,

01/04/2008 19:49:07
399
"the SNP have taken very careful measures to eradicate anti-Englishness in Scotland."

Wohahahahahahaha! Hoohahaha!! (LOL etc)
359

Hamish Scott,

01/04/2008 19:49:50
#400
You don't seem to understand the seriousness of what you are/were doing, all the more reason to stop it.
360

Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 19:54:15
399
"It is the most exemplary movement of its kind in the world." Quite! And Alex is the greatest scot ever to draw breadth. Wendy is rubbish.
www.snp.org u know u want 2
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01/04/2008 19:55:41
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Dekester,

Canada's westcoast 01/04/2008 20:12:55
#357.

You appear to be a fool. Why insult ex-pats.Is that not a sterotype?
Many ex-pats have contributed greatly to the image of Scots abroad.
A little known fact is that Scots golf pros( many from the Carnoustie area} emigrated to the eastern U.S. and assisted in developing so many of the fine golf institutions along the east coast.

You do not know anything about me.

Why attack ex-pats. Many of us still maintain homes in Scotland. As well as pursuing business interests "back home". Most hold dual citizenship. Most I know have done all right for themselves.

Who would you be? It is near certain you are small minded. You certainly have a resentment against ex-pats. Why is that?

Maybe we will meet in August when we are "back home" you will be easy to spotas the one with the massive canyon in your shoulder.I will nod as I pass.

All the best, Scotland forever.



363

Enigma,

01/04/2008 20:18:17
402

And more English people are hacked off at the stream of anglophobia which spouts from north of the Border yet wonder why so many scots have for so long held so much power over England.
364

Enigma,

01/04/2008 20:22:49
407

I don`t much wish to know anything about you.


You appear fully to justify the stereotype. Not just a rose tinted romatic but a pillock too. If I do have the misfortune to meet you next August, which I doubt, I`ll know a plastic when I see one.
365

Lady Golightly,

The Manor House 01/04/2008 20:32:37
"Believe it. The English would be terrified of a united and independent Scotland. Tens of thousands of ex-pats would be re-unified. What would become of jolly old England?"


Jeeves, pass me my smelling salts, I've never laughed so much in all my life. What a load of horlicks this chap talks.


366

Dekester,

Canada's westcoast 01/04/2008 20:32:40
#409

Pillock..you must be English. Or at least are "wannabee"

I am off to do a bit of business in Vancouver now. I will be getting a quote on building that bridge for that canyon over your shoulder.

Enigima?? What the heck kinda of a sign on is that if not arrogant, or maybe even delusional??

All the best, you scoundrel.
367

Enigma,

01/04/2008 20:37:08
411

And you, the arrogant idiot who presumes to know what the English think. Chips, look to your own shoulder.
368

Stefania Alvarez,

01/04/2008 20:44:04
Media 1 ...
You seem to be wasting your energy here ... the nationalists have already made up their minds.

Anyone who opposes ... the unnecessary break up of Britain
... they label a Unionist troll
... or resort to a tirade of abuse.

But I agree
... I find Salmond really smarmy
... and a careerist opportunist
... who has his position courtesy of the SNP people who support him.




Stepford Nat ... I find it extremely hard to take your nickname serious.

Have you ever seen the Katherine Ross film from the 1970's "Stepford Wives"
... the recent Hollywood remake
... with Nicole Kidman
... was rubbish
369

Stefania Alvarez,

01/04/2008 20:56:33
No actually Stepford Nat ...
... if you are not really someone taking the mickey out of the SNP

... you must be a teenager
... who randomly picked your nickname not understanding it's significance.
370

Hamish Scott,

01/04/2008 20:56:36
#357
"`Scots have had a huge influence on the World, as Scots not British`.

Rubbish, as enthusiastic participants in the British Empire."

This is the problem with the ignorance of people like you - because you are ignorant of something you think it doesn't exist/isn't true. Indeed, the PRESUMPTION itself is bad enough but sadly par for the course for a certain 'type' we are better free from.
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01/04/2008 21:03:50
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Enigma,

01/04/2008 21:05:28
415


You have an ability to dress so much flatulence up as educated insight.
373

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeen/shire 01/04/2008 21:25:50
374 Media 1 Cape Town

Some posters are unable to string substantiated logic together, because they are really agent provocateurs. And that is the biggest problem in this debacle! Slowly but surely these posters are doing what all agent provocateurs do, they wake up to the realisation that they are not real posters and writing a good post is a lot more intense, important and difficult than they thought they knew.

Ring any bells?
374

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 01/04/2008 21:28:00
#393 Media 1 writes:-

“I see Salmond as a man with a personal agenda! He is a wee boy who does not like the English, and if he isnt that is how he comes across…”

You don’t really know very much about this subject do you?

Do a wee bit of research, and maybe you will find out that not only that does our First Minister not hate the “English”, he actually quite likes them.

Indeed, he even married one of them.

You come across as a redneck clown, and I am glad that you have been expelled from our country.

We have no need for your ilk, stay away.

We want to bring on board those who wish to progress the well being of the residents of our country.

What is your motivation?

375

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeen/shire 01/04/2008 21:30:00
418

Give us some insight then Enigma.

I've looked up your last 4 posts only to find offensive behaviour and nothing of any substance.

What's your take on the story above?
376

Narcussus,

USA 01/04/2008 21:30:31
418 (ldopas)

Care to elaborate you dumb founded little britlander.
377

Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 21:32:29
420 bwa

See what sacrifice this man makes for diplomacy! How generous of spirit, how selfless, to marry an englander so he appears to like them.
378

Truely English,

01/04/2008 21:33:43
The Scots made their name during the British Empire and without it Glasgow, Edinburgh and Aberdeen would never have be noticed worldwide today.

It is because of Britain that Livingstone and Slessor went into Africa to preach and not because of Scotland.
As to the difference in Europe, Scotland is British as is England. Germany and France on the other hand are different and this you can find out if you spend any time in both countries.
379

Enigma,

01/04/2008 21:36:01
If you percieve `offensive behaviour` that says more about you than me. I made no comment about the story, merely about the crass presumption and ignorance of our Canadian friend.
380

OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 21:36:35
The story of the day. No pun in sight.


http://www.thecourier.co.uk/output/2008/03/31/newsstory11142329t0.asp
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Narcussus,

USA 01/04/2008 21:38:09
424

So what man are you another stupid little self correcting because i told you so little britlander
the scotch have done more for the USA than you stuck up self correcting english.who bailed you lot out in the war and who is our little poodle
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01/04/2008 21:39:10
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Narcussus,

USA 01/04/2008 21:43:45
guys dont take any trash from the britlanders go for your separation Guys cananda and Australia are going to dump the english queen and you should do the same
it is all the poor countries that cling to britlander disappearing empire ireland got out you do the same
384

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeen/shire 01/04/2008 21:44:06
425 Enigma

I'm genuinely interested in what you think. You've obviously entered this thread so you must have a view.
385

Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 21:46:16
428
OK, maybe he wasn't as selfless as I thought, but she is old, and that's almost an equivalent act of generosity and selflessness
386

Narcussus,

USA 01/04/2008 21:47:51
428
is that meant to be laughed at what are you on about.i have read some trash but some of you lot take the cookie
387

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeen/shire 01/04/2008 21:47:58
424 Truely

Aberdeen wasn't noticed worldwide until the discovery of North Sea Oil. Before that it was a large fishing town.
388

Enigma,

01/04/2008 21:50:14
Going a bit off the point aren`t we?

If Scots want to go their own way it`s up to them, for what it`s worth I think England will be better off in every sense. Comparisons with the `Celtic Tiger` seem a little over the top since Scotland will not benefit from the same EU largesse as Ireland.

To clarify once more, my point was about the presumption and obvious ignorance of another poster.
389

Lady Golightly,

01/04/2008 21:50:28
431

Absolutely! The little lion leader is practically a saint already. Maybe not so rampant nowadays, but time marches on for all of us.
390

Stepford Nat..,

01/04/2008 21:53:30
435
This is no country for old women
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01/04/2008 21:54:19
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Narcussus,

USA 01/04/2008 21:54:32
434 ldopas the UK is inferior to the US anyways. Which country was crushed during World War II and had to count on the US to bail it out???? Oh yeah, the UK. If you could've handled your affairs back then, maybe our Presidents wouldn't have to tell your Prime Ministers how to govern. Ever think of that????
393

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeen/shire 01/04/2008 21:57:07
434 Enigma

Thanks for your opinion. However, the story was about promoting Scotland abroad whilst still in the UK. It wasn't about independence.

I understand your point about correcting another poster, but surely you're not just 'trolling' the threads to do that?
394

Beth Boyle,

NY 01/04/2008 21:59:06
I agree with Border Scot and Tweedmouth on many points. Big talk is not the same as big deeds. I am still waiting for something with substance from Salmond. Oh my, we should let fools like Trump ride rough shod over the countryside so the world thinks Scotland is forward thinking. Oh we should grab back the Lewis chessmen that were made my the Norse. Oh we should change the name of Tartan week to Scotland week so people take us seriously as a modern nation. Oh we are all puffed up and tell the Americans we are a powerhouse and are in fact the Great Celtic Lion. We call that kind of rubbish "Spin" over here. It's darn close to propaganda. Much of this new drive for independence seems driven for a dislike of the flood of immigrants in the UK. No one wants to bring up that touchy subject here eh? Salmond is excellent at posturing but its getting late now and there is yet to be any real change under his management.
395

Narcussus,

USA 01/04/2008 22:01:18
440
You speak the Queen's English? Okay, um, ever hear of the Revolutionary War? We don't care about your 'royal' family. All they did was get born into the right family. It's like genetic affirmative action.
NY my ass.
396

Enigma,

01/04/2008 22:05:27
439

No I`m not `trolling the threads`, but rubbish such as his cannot go without comment.

The headline `Celtic lion` is an obvious reference to the success of an independent irish republic.Promoting Scotland abroad or whatever else, the end game is clear.
397

Enigma,

01/04/2008 22:05:58
439

No I`m not `trolling the threads`, but rubbish such as his cannot go without comment.

The headline `Celtic lion` is an obvious reference to the success of an independent irish republic.Promoting Scotland abroad or whatever else, the end game is clear.
398

Neil Waugh,

Old Strathcona 01/04/2008 22:07:55
#440

"All they did was get born into the right family. It's like genetic affirmative action."

Err..Isn't that how Dubya and Jeb got where they are today??
And lets not even talk about the Kennedys.
399

Jack and the Bean Stalk,

London 01/04/2008 22:08:04
438 Narcussus Think about 1960s and 1970s and a small Asian country who had no bombers or fighters,no Patton tanks, and they still defeated you. That country-Vietnam. You never learnt any lessons then and Dubya invaded Iraq and it is turning out be another Vietnam!
400

European Scot,

01/04/2008 22:10:41
424 'Truely' English

"As to the difference in Europe, Scotland is British as is England. Germany and France on the other hand are different and this you can find out if you spend any time in both countries.

So Scotland is British and England is British.
Well you got that half right, the last part is correct.
A certain French president visited London recently and spoke of the importance of not only France's relationship with Germany in Europe, but also of France's relationship with ........ Angleterre.
The very British Gordon Brown, who was standing alongside, must have had teeth marks on his tongue, as Sarkozy spoke about England instead of Britain.
Nothing new here then, Angleterre is synonymous with Britain on the continent.
The sooner Scotland emerges from the smothering effects of Britain, and re-establishes its own identity the better.
Scotland at the United Nations will do for starters.
401

OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 22:13:18
#440 Beth in amongst your ignorant post was this gem,

"Much of this new drive for independence seems driven for a dislike of the flood of immigrants in the UK."

You are utterly and completely wrong. Here's the most perfect example of migrants to Scotland becoming Scottish.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=I17Jk-nIskU&feature=related
402

Andrew BOD,

Aberdeen/shire 01/04/2008 22:16:53
Beth Boyle from New York

says...
"Salmond is excellent at posturing but its getting late now and there is yet to be any real change under his management."

There's been more change from this Minority Government in 10 months, both in substance and style, than there has been from the LibLabs in 10 years!

It's refreshing to see someone fighting Scotland's corner for a change. Forget independence, he's trying to get Scotland's economic growth rate up to the UK's. Something the last lot forgot about.

So what's your real point then?


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01/04/2008 22:16:54
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OscarMaxApfel,

01/04/2008 22:19:32
#449 As you've excellently demonstrated Mr Whiz.
405

Jack and the Bean Stalk,

01/04/2008 22:19:43
441 Narcussus

Think about this. You seem clever. How come big banks in your country with clever people from ivy league universities gave billions of dollars as motgage loans to poor who were never in any jobs and could never pay back the loan-the sub-prime mortgages, and these banks with clever people are ruining the world economy. My grandmother could have asked a few questions.
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Andrew BOD,

Aberdeen/shire 01/04/2008 22:21:55
449 Worth ignoring and reporting.
407

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01/04/2008 22:24:06
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01/04/2008 22:25:33
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Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 22:28:33
440 Dubya did not serve in Vietnam when all his countrymen were fighting and dying. Instead he was in National Guard close to his dad's home in Texas! Dubya's dad Mr Bush was then an ambassador to China and before that CIA director fixed this. There you have 'genetic affirmative action'
410

Shamus,

Glasgow 01/04/2008 22:36:31
Maybe Mr Salmond could put us all in the picture and explain what a Celtic Lion is.Please.
411

Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 22:37:17
#456 That is your interprtation. I think you should worry more about the Tram construction that goes through your area.
412

Truely English,

01/04/2008 22:42:33
The Americans shoot down their own pilots, kill lots of their own soldiers, so we dont need much advice from that side of the Atlantic when it comes to warfare.

Scotland is an integral part of Britain and as yet only a small portion North of the Border would want to split away from the rest of Britain.

I hope this does not happen but if it does how safe and secure will minorities be considering what we read on these pages.
413

Another Nationalistic Penis,

01/04/2008 22:48:13
McCrone Report.

We was robbed = FACT
414

Jack and the Bean Stalk,

LONDON 01/04/2008 22:50:25
#462. What are you guys doing in this unionist paper any way? If you are so sure about the win win situation, you should get your fellow scots to vote for you
415

subrosa,

01/04/2008 23:02:14
# 465 I may well ask what are you doing on a Scottish newspaper's forum? Has the Sun had enough of you now?
416

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 23:31:19
Sigh, so it continues. Still clinging onto the endless negative campaigning.

467. Probably the ones that have turned the UK from the 'sick man of Europe' into its strongest economy. The same ones that has given Scotland its lowest unemployment rate in 34 years. The very same ones that have replaced the manufacturing industries lost to the Far East with the new money-spinners of finance and the knowledge-based industries of high-tech/bio-tech. Yep, even the same ones that have given us 30% higher spending than 'mighty' (read heavily EU-aided) Ireland.

The usual ****ing ones that get repeated over and over again!
417

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 23:31:30
Sigh, so it continues. Still clinging onto the endless negative campaigning.

467. Probably the ones that have turned the UK from the 'sick man of Europe' into its strongest economy. The same ones that has given Scotland its lowest unemployment rate in 34 years. The very same ones that have replaced the manufacturing industries lost to the Far East with the new money-spinners of finance and the knowledge-based industries of high-tech/bio-tech. Yep, even the same ones that have given us 30% higher spending than 'mighty' (read heavily EU-aided) Ireland.

The usual ****ing ones that get repeated over and over again!
418

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 23:36:07
How is the nationalist morale after Our Great Leader confirmed that support for independence is "only a quarter"? Not the wishful 40-44% quoted by so many of you.

That's precisely where it was a year ago before you all started you endless whinging about the UK, isn't it.

You nats (both SNP and their sheep) have pulled out all the stops, mobbed every news site with your increasingly astonishing claims, used every breath to trash, abuse and insult everyone who had the temerity to say you're wrong.....and you have got absolutely nowhere.

Ouch.
419

Highland Mighty,

01/04/2008 23:38:24
"increasingly astonishing claims" = "The dutys on Alcohol and Tobacco are kept artificially high to stimulate the Smuggling trade.

Though proximity to the markets means that it is more profitable in the SE."

Yes, indeed everyone. The Treasury are deliberately stimulating smuggling and vat-evasion. Makes all the sense in the world. No holes in that claim at all.
420

Conan the Librarian™,

01/04/2008 23:51:04
472
The abuse I see comes from one quarter(And it isn't the Nationalist one).

SNP and their sheep?Are you implying something?

Being "belaboured" over the head by constantly repeated statistics is not, and never will be debate.
Polls are a very rough guide, elections count.
Or in the case of Labour managed ones; recount.
421

Conan the Librarian™,

02/04/2008 00:00:56
476
Col.
Are you in collusion with Meths?(Put me down for some bottles of Licor 43;-)
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Wuerzburg,

Germany . 02/04/2008 17:42:54
You , Marcussus , being evidentally an unintelligent fat turd don´t deserve any response from those on these pages and certainly , normally I steer clear of those such as you . However on this occasion I would like to raise one or two points . You turdstuff live in a country that is fast declining . Nobody in the world has much interest in buying anything made in America simply because it is incapable of making anything that works . Your country is spiralling into a mountain of international debt it will be unable to repay with the net result that foreigners now own America . You have an immigration problem that is swamping you , with poverty at a level , akin to Africa and latin America but which has been long banished from Europe . How the country handled the floods in Louisiana tells a thousand stories . You suffered unmitigated military defeat at the hands of a Vietnamese enemy who had more courage in their toenails than GIs displayed in their bombers , tanks and Coca Cola trucks . Mogadishu springs to mind . In Germany I personally experienced an outbreak of vandalism by black US soldiers to which the US Army MPs refused through cowardice to respond . German gun carrying civilian Police were called into Leighton Barracks , Wuerzburg , to restore order . I have a hundred other stories like this to tell you chum . The trouble is that fat turds like you think you are so great when the opposite is true . Anyway the Chinese will soon come knocking with a tad more threat than Iraq . Its downhill fast for you fatso .

 

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